Ep 236 Accepting the Superpower of ADHD with Paulette Perhach

Pencils&Lipstick podcast · Sep 09, 2024

Transcript

Hey everyone, welcome to Pencils and Lipstick. This is Kat Caldwell and you are listening to episode 236 of the podcast. This is our second episode since the summer. I guess I should just embrace the word season. We're into our sixth season and this is the second episode because we take a break in the summertime, as one should. It is September 9th as this goes out and I think I've heard from like five different people, even my dentist, that they can't believe it's September already. So if that's how you feel, I hope that you're settling in into this, you know, wonderful fall month. I love September and October so you know I like summer but I just love fall. I just love it. So I'm loving it. I can believe that it's September. I'm having quite a good time. I just I just love this month. This last week I got to go see live and Stone Temple Pilots so that was super fun. I had a very good time. And it reminded me that while we can't all afford to go to concerts constantly because they're ridiculously expensive these days, you know, whatever happened to the $50 concert, I missed out on seeing you two in 98 and it was because it was $50. And to me, that was just an exorbitant amount at the time. So maybe it's just inflation, whatever. I don't No, I'm a writer, not a mathematician or an economist. So while at the concert, I was thinking, well, we can't always go to concerts constantly, right? We can't afford that.

It is still really important as a writer to have experiences, right? To go out and see the world, to go out and allow yourself to absorb a different art form, a different experience, to meet people, to see things, to allow your brain just a break from the writing and the creating all the time. Maybe you don't have this issue. I don't know. But I think if you have been writing your book for a while or you've been writing books for a while and you feel a little burned out or you you feel a little empty. Perhaps you need a shift in experience. And if, you know, if you don't feel empty, before you do feel empty, go out and have an experience. I actually found an art exposition that I'm going to go to. It is difficult. I understand that I have three kids. You know, the hours that I have are the hours that I have for work. Weekends are usually full of volleyball or tennis or something. There's always something. And so it is difficult, but you know, one thing a month, two things a month, and it doesn't always have to cost money. Now that it is not uber hot outside, we will be going out into nature and having a walk and a picnic and just sort of absorbing the nature around us and the beauty around us as a family. So there's that as well, right? You could take a class, you could just stick your feet into the creek water. Find festivals. It is fall.

Everywhere in America, at least, there is a festival going on. In fact, if you look Google, what is going on this weekend near me, you will find stuff. I promise you. In fact, I have been to some really fun festivals just because I Googled it. I also really like, you know, I went to like this old like farm equipment festival, but But there were people that were doing ironwork and there's like this whole antique toy museum, I guess. I don't know. I like that stuff. But I think that it just sort of gives your brain a break and it helps to feed the creativity. And then the problem is getting only five hours of sleep because the concert's really far away, and you can't remember what story idea you came up with during the concert. Just exactly, exactly what happened to me. But you know, I no longer really fret that much about those things. My brain is going to run away with itself constantly. And if the idea is good, it'll come back. So, kind of speaking about my brain running away with itself, I have taken myself to task to start learning, kind of in this last year, how my brain works, how I work, how I can work better, how I can get the things done that I want to get done, even when life hits

me because a couple things have really hit this year and I don't see things not hitting in the near future. So I've been trying to figure that out. I Becca Simons community which is the Patreon, the CliftonStrengths community and that is really interesting. I am gung -ho about CliftonStrengths. I think that it's amazing. I do feel that there's still a lot more for me to try to understand about them and how they work for me. But today I invited Paulette Perhash in to talk about her journey with ADHD because I think it is possible that quite a few of us who were born in the early 80s and late 70s

have neuro differences that weren't really talked about and we haven't explored. And I don't know, Paulette says that it was great for her to get the diagnosis and that is a possibility that that will be more freeing to you. It's not always, you know, insurance wise and whatever, it's not always a choice that we get to, you know, choose. But I am going to be bringing in quite a few other people to talk about either their ADHD or their different ways of doing things and getting things done. I am one person who doesn't like excuses. That's why I choose my one -on -one clients very carefully. I have a hard time with people making excuses for a decade on stuff. But, you know, before you get mad at me, I think part of that excuse, this is sort of what I'm thinking these days, is they don't quite know how their brain works and how to work with it in order to get the book done. The other possibility is that they don't really know the story.

They just are haunted by a character. And that's something that I'm going to be exploring as well. I'm thinking about that a lot as well. So I'm going to be bringing in different people. We're going to be talking about the way that they've learned to organize their day, the way that they get all their marketing and things done, and you are going to have to understand, and I will try to remind you every time, no one's schedule is going to work for you at all. You know, it's just, and they're going to make it sound easy because that's what works for them. Sorry, I had to make sure I was recording. That's what works for them, but you're never going to be able to just copy paste ever. Right? And so you have to be careful about how easy it all sounds because that person has found their rhythm and then trying to copy paste it into your life and getting frustrated. What I really want to encourage you is to find your rhythm and find the way that works for you. And the point of bringing different people in is to show how very different it can be. Okay, so I am still exploring if I have ADHD, you know, all those like online tests show high possibility. I've never gotten myself fully diagnosed and I'm trying to decide for myself personally if it

even makes sense or if I'm just gonna continue down the road of trying to figure out how to do the things that I want to do. Because I do get things done, it's just that sometimes I feel like I'm on a hamster wheel. So don't forget that Bended Loyalty comes out in just two weeks as this podcast goes out. So if you want to pre -order it, you can do that and the links are in the show notes. You can read Bended Dream for free, the link is in the show notes. And if you want to hear my musings, I'm not really here if you want to read my musings that are kind of like these beginning parts I'm even sign up to my sub sub stack called lessons and story You can also read my short stories with any critiques that I got back a lot of my short stories. I wrote because of contests and I will then get critiques back and So I'm putting those up as well because I think that we can learn a lot from those and that is under the paid part My thoughts on writing for the moment are all free, so you know, be sure to check that out. We also, I have my writer's newsletter in which you hear all about the workshops, if you want the right tools for getting your story done or for marketing your book. In fact, next week is the marketing workshop. I'm bringing in all different people to teach you the things that you might need to know. So, this month, September 17th, is the Marketing for Authors Who Hate Marketing with Lynn Bohart, and next month we are learning how to write excellent villains with Louis Georgetown. And then in November, you can learn how to build out a fiction series, if you're thinking about doing that with Tracy Gardner. So there's lots of stuff going on. There's always lots of things going on in my corner of the world.

So get on my writer's newsletter if you want to hear more about them. Otherwise, the links are in the show notes. And I hope that you guys enjoy this interview with Paulette Perhach. Her links are also in the show notes if you wanted to join her cohort masterclass, whatever you want to call it, if you want to hear more about her, more from her. She had a great article come out just last week. So if you're on her newsletter, you will hear about that stuff. She's a great writer, and I think that you are going to enjoy this greatly. So without further ado, let's get into the interview. Today I have a guest with me. Her name is Paulette Perhach. She is a writer, an essayist, and an article writer, I would say. I don't know, what's the title that you give yourself? Creative nonfiction writer. I also have a novel that I've been working on forever. Awesome. I love it.

What we're going to talk about mostly about, you are the first person that I thought of, is writing when you have ADD or ADHD. I thought about you, especially because you're very open about it, but as a nonfiction creative writer who's really pitching all the time, I figured you have a ton of balls in the air all the time. You have to pitch, you have to write, you have to think of a new thing to pitch, you have to, like, who has responded? I can think of all the Excel files and then I think, like, how does somebody who has ADHD even, like, that sounds very overwhelming. So let's talk a little bit, why don't you give us a little intro into your journey as a writer and finding out as an adult that you had ADHD? Yeah. So I went to school for magazine journalism. I always on yearbook or, you know, just like in English classes and in school and yearbook. I really liked it because you got to like go off campus. And so then I did magazine journalism. I always wanted it to be like, like I love field trips. I love being out in the world. So that's what brought me to like journalism, and then I've always had big emotions. So Sad Girl Essay is like my home base. And in my school, you could take, instead of a foreign language, you could take computer classes. So I took three semesters of personal software. Bit me in the butt later when I joined Peace Corps and could say like the days of the week and pig and cow, but that was neither here nor there.

And so I learned Excel really well in college. Like, my final project was a business plan that was 200 pages when printed, like a spreadsheet. Oh my gosh. That's crazy. And I would always say, oh my gosh, Excel is the brain I wasn't born with. Like, I love Excel. I love it. Like, oh, I need it. If I'm doing math, I need a spreadsheet. And so then I interned at, you know, some magazines, was a small town reporter, then did Peace Corps. And, you know, I've always struggled with impulsive spending, I bite my nails, I shake my leg, I, you know, I'm always, my mind is always racing, for sure. I don't sleep well. And I'm also funny and I love adventures and I'm spontaneous and I'm playful. So, let's not forget the good part.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And so I was interviewing an expert on ADHD, and we got to chatting, and he said, hey, it kind of sounds like you have ADHD. How old were you? I was 35, I believe, and because I was writing my book that year, and I was making no money and working so hard, the test, the official test, was $260, so I didn't do it. Right. And I, what I thought ADHD was, was I have a hard time focusing, I get distracted easily. Okay. Done and done. Right? And I was like, okay, like, what am I going to do with that information anyway? So I took an online test, it's like high likelihood of ADHD, so we were like, haha, I probably have ADHD. But I didn't really do anything about it. And it was only years later when I was still struggling so hard, I had an insufficient And like, but I was like, just still swirling that I was like, all right, let's figure this out. Like, is this ADHD? And then I got tested when I was 38. So like, officially, three years ago, this month, actually. And so officially tested and they were like, well, like, during that time, they asked, do you have trouble with organization? And I was like, well, not now. I had to literally dedicate a decade of my life to studying programs and getting my systems in place.

So like, yeah, I got it handled, but like it kicked my ass for a long, long, long And so they were like, well, we're gonna like put that as a yes. And so after the test, the guy was like, well, we don't often get 20 out of 20. So like I have very severe raging ADHD. Hey, 100%, A plus, you passed the test. Yeah. So what did that change though? because I feel like, you know, as products of early 80s, I think we're both the same age, it's like, I don't know about you, but growing up, it was kind of a joke or like, kind of like what you said, okay, great, like ADHD, oh, I can't focus, whatever. And it sounds like there's a misconception around that that you've learned. So like, what changed, like, did it help at all

to know, to have this diagnosis? Oh my God, like immensely, the amount of self -compassion. And so some of the things I didn't know about ADHD is that there's something called rejection -sensitive dysphoria, which is like makes rejection really like almost physically painful. So when someone's like, you're too sensitive, right? It's like any rejection is very painful to us. So it's great to be a writer. Great to be a writer. It's like a lot of artists are ADHD. So that's where like the idea generation comes from, right? There's also something, you know, there there's just a literal dopamine shortage in our brain. So we're always going after things like I'm always it's like we're starting we're like a, you a slingshot that's pulled back and we're constantly trying to burst forward because there's just this energy. Okay. So, you know, I struggled with some like low grade addictions in my 20s and 30s and you know things like using food for entertainment for sure I'm on there I have to be really cannot keep sweets in my house like not

happening and then there's something called hyper focus where you I used to make jewelry and I would sit on a couch until it felt like my eyes were about to start bleeding and then I I would always leave a mess because I would do it for so long until like my body physically I'm like I have to stop and then I was too tired to clean stuff up. I'm messy. I have such a hard time. Paperwork is so hard for me because those activities, things that don't give you dopamine, they're hard for other people. It's like for us, you just can't, it's just so much harder. There's this block that once I met other people who understood what that block was like and helped me realize you're not making this up. It just was this huge sense of self -compassion and relate. Right. The other explanation is you're lazy and you're not a good person, right? Yeah, that's the thing. I'm sure everyone as an adult has heard that at some point in their life. Like they can't, you know, somebody accusing them of being lazy or disorganized or a mess or you just need more self -discipline. This is probably stuff that they grow up hearing, right? You get 20 ,000 more negative messages during your childhood if you have ADHD on average. I don't know how they I that. But I definitely had a reputation for being lazy. But when I get so much done. You know what I mean? It's like weird. Oh and hated, I just was like, the game for me was to beat the system of school without learning anything. And now I love adult education. I read more, I learn more than I absolutely have to. And in classes where I could be creative

and it was project -based, I was full on. If I'm on something, you cannot get me off it. I'm like, back away, you know? But sometimes, like when eBay came out, I went nuts and I could not stop buying things on eBay because it was the dopamine of shopping with the dopamine of winning. My friends had to have an intervention. They were like, pull it. Like so many boxes are coming to the house.

What are you doing in your room at night? I'm like, I, and like, what was that? There was that thing that was, it was like a button you clicked. Oh, stumble upon. It was a button that brought you to the next website, I, it's like an out -of -body experience where you're like, I cannot stop clicking this button. I'm really lucky and glad I've never gotten a gambling addiction because I could not, you just, someone described ADHD as being possessed by yourself and that's what it feels like. So funny. So now that you have like some education on this and sort of connecting the dots, Are you able to recognize those things in yourself? Are you able to stop them? Or how does that work now?

Way more able to recognize when I'm in hyper focus, when I'm doing something, it's like my brain's going, brain's going, and then it's like my conscious steps back and it's like, okay, I see what's going on here. All right, we're gonna let this go. If it's like 7 .24, I'm like, we're gonna let this go till 7 .30, and then we're gonna stop. Like we're gonna stop at 7 .30.

And I've had to do that. I did that one time shopping. When I'm leaving a place that I have traveled to and I do that last minute shop, there is this thing where I try to just collect everything that the happy memories are now in shopping form where I'm like, I take it all with me. Oh my God, this and this and this. And one time my sister called me and I was like, thank God. I was like, oh my God, I'm so glad you're here. I'm like, I need you to listen to me, walk to my car and leave this shopping area currently, please.

Like, because I'm like, I'm watching, I'm having an out of body experience. Right. And did that come because of the like, after the diagnosis and the recognition, recognition of what this is? That was before my diagnosis. Okay. But I mean, we already you're kind of getting there. Like, yeah, we knew that I had like a shopping binge or like a spending binge problem. So there's a lot of like, binging behavior that happened. I don't think I've ever heard that before. So I guess it could go into anything, really, like anything that sort of gets you that hit. It's anything that gives you dopamine, you know? And so people get addicted to sex, to shopping, to, you know, I've never felt like a shopping addict. It's just been that like, like with ADHD, you're often time blind, so you have a really hard time imagining the future and making the future very concrete to you. So some some things that I've heard from Russell Buckley, who's a great expert, he has said, like, make the future external. And and I kind of hate this one because, I it feels weird, but he's like talking to yourself out loud. You will listen to yourself more than if you're just trying to talk to yourself in your head. So interesting. I'm like, not that we're all like after Covid, not muttering to ourselves left and right. We're all a little insane at this point. We're a little, a little crazier than Covid. it. Um, but you know, and for me, the biggest switch has been the positive self talk versus like, you know, like, I think it's kind of funny to call myself the B word. And I'm like, all right, I'm like, come on, B, we're not doing this today. Like, oh my god, da da And that has changed to Alright, buddy. All right. I think you spent a little more than you

wanted to yesterday. But like, today's a new day. Let's go, you know, and I just really like, especially in my 20s. I had such a hard time with self compassion. Like I remember or someone saying to me, you just have to be more compassionate with yourself. And I started crying, and I was like, I just, I can't. Right, well, because you've heard, like everyone, it's easy to point out other people's flaws, and I feel like that sounds like somebody with ADHD, it's easy for other people to be like, that's what's wrong, like this. I can point all your flaws out right here, right?

Because in America, we're like productivity -based, right? Like we also, you and I grew up with like Tony Robbins, Tony Robbins. You know that like, come on, you can do it. And if you can't like get it done in that same way, you feel like you're not getting anything done. It's a weird contradiction because you do get things done. It's not like you just finally got it started getting published a year ago. That's not true. You've been working this whole time through your ADHD. So how has it, how have you seen that difference in that shift in like, as a writer, because writing is project based, right, but also like, you got to get motivated to do it. Like, there's a lot of balls in the air at all times so much.

So the what I did, which I think everyone can do is just design a piece of software. Okay. I was like, that that threw me for a No, I got my diagnosis the same month that the Writer's Mission Control Center was approved as an official Google Sheets add -on, which is how it used to be. Now it's a web app. But I was like, that's all coming together. The fact that I designed organizational software for writers, I was like, I see why now. Okay, that was pretty extreme, but that's what I had to do. Okay, to teach yourself how to keep it all together. Yeah, it's just it's a place to organize all your ideas, not make sure you don't lose things, keep track of your deadlines, keep track of where you've submitted what and where you want to submit things and, and all your projects and opportunities too. Yeah, because that's a lot, it's like, it's so much, it's like five different arms of my business too. So yeah, you're also coaching, you're also so like when you're coming, when you're writing, So, if people don't really know, like what is the process besides, you know, when you're writing a novel, you have like an idea for a novel and then you'll most likely spend like months to years on that project while life happens, right? But if you are a professional writer and you are pitching constantly to magazines and newspapers, you need to eat, you have to sell your ideas, right? So, like, how do you do that? Like, how did you do it before and then how has it changed, if it has?

So, you know, with things like journalism, you have to be keeping track of what's going on in the zeitgeist, what's, you know, trending right now. I just, like, I just got, I'm actually celebrating my 20th acceptance in the New York Times. So I'm working for the New York Times, really excited. and that came from reading, you know, you need to be reading up on what's going on and this story that I'm doing was inspired by a recent piece in the news so it's kind of a secondary feature story inspired by that. You have to get it to one editor, remember to follow up, remember not to pitch it to them again, right, once there's been enough time you have to pitch it to another editor, if you get an

opportunity you want to get on it really fast. I've become really good at following up, and that feels so good because it's so hard to do, to actually follow up on things. And I still do make mistakes, like for sure. Things that are important to me, things that I'm like, how did I drop the ball on that, right? Like I am not, I'm certainly not perfect at all, but I don't, like it's night and day from how I was, you know, 15 years ago. Okay, so before was it like, I mean, cause 15 years, like when you and I were in college, there was no iPhones, right? Like we barely had flip phones at that point. Gosh, I'm aging myself. And then I remember I learned Excel, but our laptops were like giant and clunky. And you know, so you ended up like, I had notes everywhere. Like I still do, this is ridiculous. How many?

So what did it look like in the beginning when you're forcing yourself to get these things done because you want to pass college versus like building your own software to help yourself and other writers? Yeah, so I had a date book. I was very interested in how do people do this? How are people? seemed like a mystery. Yeah, it's like a mystery. And I think the big question with someone who's growing up with ADHD is why? And you don't realize there are all these whys. Why can't I keep it together? Why can't I keep my house clean? Why can't I just fold the laundry? Why can't I wait for the right moment to do things? That's a big one for me. I'll do things that are just at an inappropriate moment where I'm like, I just can't wait. You know, like, no, we gotta do it now. Like, ah, calm down. So, you know, I was really, I really was trying. And I think that's the thing, like, and even today, I feel like I'm known as a writer who hustles and works hard. And I'm like, I'd kind of rather just be known for like my amazing writing. And I'm like, you know, which I'm obviously joking, you know, but like, joking, but not joking, like I would like to be known for my work. and I think I'm known for my struggle more than anything. And no one labels it that, but that's what it feels like. Like, I am, you know, I'm paddling with all fours, like, trying to keep my head above water, and people are like, wow, look at BoA. She's really working hard. And, you know, it just seems like other people are just gliding by with this easy free stroke. And I'm like, why is everyone just, like, surpassing me like crazy?

And so I got really interested in it and just studied. And, you know, it would look like, oh my God, like a syllabus, looking at a syllabus, or just being like, you have to read a syllabus, like, oh my God. It always felt like I missed the class on life. That's what it was. wow. That's a good way to put it. And just so many, like, apologies, feeling like you're in trouble, stress, worry, anxiety. I've also really struggled with anxiety in my life, and I think it's definitely related to ADHD. Yeah, I would think so.

I mean, at least part of it, right? Because is there a part where you're like, even if you are on top of it, there's a slight anxiety that maybe you missed something because the past has told you, you didn't always get it. Like, is there that part of it? I better than ever. And part of that was like hiring help. You know, like, I worked for a really awesome high level real estate agent in New York and she showed me how in order to scale my business and to get bigger, like I had to handle that stuff. And so this is part of what's called the ADHD tax, where like life is more expensive for ADHD or sometimes because right. For some people, if you just buy regular vegetables, you're never going to cut them up, they're going to go bad, you're going to throw them away. So like paying that little extra for the pre cut vegetables will help you do that. I've worked with a trainer online to make sure that I exercise and actually get it done for four years and that's been an amazing investment, you know. Just moved to New York. So I'm going to start going to the gym here a little bit more because I have classes and stuff. Oh, you moved across country? I did. Yeah. Wow. That's awesome. Good for you. Now, you're just going to become like the New York Times writer, I like that. But when you, so when you're, you know, you're an adult, you're accomplished, people see you, like I talked to you well before your diagnosis, I think, and you were already had a couple viral articles.

So like, like you said, like people from the outside are like, you're killing it, you're doing a great job. Was it, was it like, did it come at a cost of like a, like a physical or mental cost that you're just trying, like you said, you're treading water and trying to keep up with people. I'm trying to just think of like how other people might recognize through you if they maybe need to go actually take this serious and get a diagnosis. Oh my well, the great thing is there are all these wonderful online tests. Okay. So, just take a look. they're real? They're like, they'll really tell you? Yeah, from like ADD .org. And ADD is kind of the antiquated term now. Okay.

kind of just combining it with ADHD. But yeah, take a few tests. And if it's like, yeah, seems like you do, then you know, get officially diagnosed. That's fine. If you can afford it, like that's not it wasn't accessible to me at the time. Right. And, you know, so it's not accessible to everyone. And I think there's like enough information out there. Unless you want to get medicated, obviously, you need to get official diagnosis. But like, you can start to, you know, it's like, I was applying to some things. It's like, do you have a disability? And like ADHD is under the Disabilities Act. I'm like, no, it was weird to say. And, you like, yeah, I don't walk around with that label all the time. You know, there are it's it's a neurodivergence. It's a difference. It can be a superpower. And so but it is it's wild to see it listed there and be like, as it is, it is a difference, right? Right. I mean, it's there's there's something to like my daughter, my oldest has dyslexia and it's like on one hand we talk about it all the time kind of like what you said like the diagnosis is power because now it's like it doesn't it's not a mystery anymore you know but it you do your brain is wired differently you know and so you are at a disadvantage to those to like the average wiring of the brain right like yeah so you have to recognize and if it helps in whatever field you're in, kind of get on level playing field, that's nice. We're not looking at it for like, it's not like you have an advantage, you're already disadvantaged

and we're just trying to get people at the same spot. That's what I always tell my daughter at least. So when you started writing this software, I'm very interested in this because there are so many ways to organize yourself There are so many people out there talking about productivity. A lot of times people are talking about the same thing, right? Like, and when I say productivity, like as a writer, there are things you want to finish, produce, right? Like we have these goals. Did you start it from your Excel obsession? Is that kind of where that started? Yeah. I started looking for how are people organizing this? Okay. And I looked for, I tried to find the person who I felt like, Hey, all these writers that I know in Seattle who go to the writing center, do you have a good system? No. Do you have a good system? No. Nobody had a system.

I have like, I mean, I've been doing this now almost 10 years. I was 2015 that I started that spreadsheet. And I remember I numbered the submission tracker one to 1 ,000. I said I will do 1 ,000 submissions and then I will reassess if I want to be a writer. And no one is keeping a list of, you know, one of the things that sparked it was Priscilla Long's book, wonderful book, The Writer's Portable Mentor, and she said, have list of your works. Have a list of all the work you've done. I mean, that makes sense. You know, this is what's funny about writers. We're like, what's the best system? It's like a system. I've seen one writer, she had a list in Microsoft Word and she's like, I highlighted pink if it was accepted, yellow if I'm still waiting.

And I'm like, that is something. You can't say, show me all the ones that I'm still waiting on. I love the way that it gives me an overview. So one example, daily example is, I had a meeting with an editor of a magazine on creativity and technology. And in the Writer's Mission Control Center, where you can tag stories by theme, whatever themes you write about. And so I was able to filter down to the ones with those tags and I went to our meeting with 12 story ideas. And I look like a story idea machine, right? Really, it's a recognition of the intellectual property that are your ideas and your drafts. And I think writers partially probably because we've been conditioned to see our work as non -essential, not valuable. where like, oh, that was an idea, whatever, oh, I sent that draft, I don't know. You know, like, to have it all in one place and then to have a system where you can get a better overview, I think is really helpful. Yeah, I would think so, because you said that ideation is a superpower for ADHD. Yeah. So you probably don't value it as much unless you have it, unless you give it value, right? I have something like 370 story ideas in my ideation control center right now.

But it's been 10 years. Yeah, yeah. It's like one a week, I think on average. But you're right, like if you have life throwing itself at you, and you're going 180 miles an hour, you might not remember what you had before or like, even the value for, for something that might have gotten rejected a year ago, it might still be a good idea. Oh, 1000%. Yeah, I mean, that that older stuff, your ideas really don't expire. There are ways there's like one thing I've written that was like a parody about the pandemic like that was in a certain time and place, that I'm like, okay, I think that's over. But most of my ideas, it's like, that's, you know, they can, they're useful no matter when,

when an opportunity arises. Okay. So what do you, what do you feel about, I mean, I want, I want, is the, is the software available? Like, do you sell it or do you, do become part of your group? So. Yeah, the software you can get just on its own too. On its own. Okay. So, we'll definitely have a link to that. But you also have started talking about this within like the creative and the writer's world, right? In order to really help writers. So, talk to me about this. Do you call it a class or like a... Yeah. Harnessing ADHD's wild horsepower? Yeah. So, I'm calling it a party slash class. I like the party part. And it's really inspiring to me to create a class that's just for people with ADHD because it's got to be like fireworks and one of the things that helped me do well on the SATs was this Kaplan software back in the day and I just remember it had these like silly little animations that kept me engaged and I knew if I wanted to go to college I had to get a good SAT scores because there was there's no Santa there's no camp there's no college fun that was those Those my two big revelations in my childhood. There still no money on the backyard tree.

I don't know. So because that software was so interesting, I was able to keep at it. And I did get a good score. And I was able to get scholarships to college mostly. And so I'm designing a class. Number one, the most important thing is that people come in there and they're like, Like everyone in here has ADHD and everyone understands what it's like to be me. Right. Oh my God. Just the relief there because about one in 20 people have ADHD. So chances are in your small social circle, it's just you and you feel like a weirdo, which I've felt a lot. And the other thing is we're going to bring in experts on ADHD. We have amazing guest speakers, psychologists, coaches, people who really understand how take your brain. The writer Emily Ferris who wrote I'll Just Be Five More Minutes is going to come in. I'm excited about her. And we're going to have a session that's just for friends and family, not for the writers so that friends and family can ask questions and kind of feel like they have an open space that they won't like offend the person but just get like really honest answers. And we'll also tell them for you like it's not something that this person has control over, you know. It's not an excuse either, but it's to accommodate. It's an operating system that you have to accommodate and so to talk about how you can accommodate together. Right. That's a really good idea. I haven't heard of anyone doing that, but it makes sense

now that you say it. I mean, I just about what I would really want. Yeah, please tell my family that I'm fine. Well, it just sounds, it does sound like an excuse, you know? And I think it's hard for other people. It's just so, it's been really interesting to be, to realize the patterns in my own mind and to be like, oh yeah, oh yeah. You know, and I've talked about like, I don't know. It's just, it gets deeper and deeper where I'm like, just, it's like the end of the usual suspects movie where I'm just like, Oh, it's all making sense. Like that was it. And that was it. And you don't think all these different things are connected and they're all part of ADHD. And I think that's why the, it just has such a branding issue because it's like, it is this one thing, attention and we don't have a deficit. We we have a control issue with our attention. Oh, that's interesting. So even the title of it feels like it's not, it doesn't really explain it properly. Someone pointed out that it's named for how it affects other people. How other people deserve it. see that, yes. In the American medical system,

it's how it affects the doctors and adults around you. Yeah, so. That makes sense. Okay, so I'm thinking about this idea of like you said that it's not an excuse but it is kind of an excuse. And I've heard this a couple times and I think people, maybe because those of us who don't have it or don't have it or aren't familiar with it, they sort of skirt around it a lot. And instead of giving people, I was listening to a writer, talk to other writers, and I was well, unless you have ADHD. And I was like, well, you're just like throwing a whole group of people over here, but you're not actually giving them any tools. Like you're saying, well, this tool, you know, this isn't going to help you because you have ADHD and clearly you're not going to be able to pay attention to this. But that's not necessarily true. It's like, again, you are very successful. You're getting your stuff done.

So it even feels like from the people who don't have it, that it's like an excuse, It's a throwaway excuse of pushing people into this corner. I think the difference is with an excuse, you say, I can't, I have ADHD, period. An explanation in an operating system is, I have ADHD, so I'm going to do it this way. I'm going to do it that way, and to take it in stride, but to be like, that's not going to stop me, and I take responsibility. it's almost like people who have childhood drama and then have really like violent or negative personalities in adulthood. It's like, you were not responsible for your childhood trauma. You're responsible for going to therapy now though. That makes sense. So it's like, I'm not that I have ADHD. I am responsible for accommodating for it myself in service of the people around me, my friends and family and the jobs that I have to do. Yeah, in service of yourself as well. And I want to go back to like the self -talk because I think that is probably the place that will change the most and have the biggest impact, right?

Like anyone who is our age or, I mean, this generation, I watch my kids where I'm like, wow, you guys have some confidence because, and it's so jarring because of how we grew up versus how they grew up, right? And like self -talk, I don't know about you, but like anyone around me who was ever self -talking, it wasn't very nice to themselves. So like you already have that, right? And then you're saying that people with ADHD, the self -talk is really negative. Is that true? Is that what you're saying? Yeah, I mean, that's kind of a, I think probably a bit more of a blanket statement than I would make without more data.

But I think because we get so much negative feedback feedback from being clumsy and forgetting and, you know, so many mistakes that ADHD caused you to make. I have like the worst sense of direction in the world. I think we can internalize a lot of that. Okay. And then it comes out. Yeah. Yeah. And I've definitely heard from a lot of people that that's a problem too. So I think really bringing the vibe up in the class is a big goal of mine. Yeah. I'm I think I just think about writers and the way that we set this whole industry up Like I put up today on social media because like social me is social media an issue Well, maybe not for you, but so it could be right. It could be one of those issues where you like So yeah, it's really I use the freedom app It's not on my phone have been made, like, by a person with ADHD as one of their softwares. Oh, yeah. then sometimes I'll have to take it off my phone for something, like, oh, I have to do an Instagram Live or whatever, and I'll be like, I'll put it back on in a second.

And days have passed now, and I'm – it's, like, ruining my life. Like, it's low -key ruining my life because, like, I mean, over time, because someone called it attention confetti. Oh, for sure. I use non -stop, just like this and that. Non -stop dopamine, right? then when I don't have it, I'm like, oh yeah, that's not real life. I got it. exactly.

Oh, look at all this stuff I got done. I know, it's this plush and pull. But I put out there today, because you have to put something out there, that I refuse to accept this fact in the writing world that you have to work on one project at a time. Like, that's not how I work, and that I have finally decided that's not how I work. Like I have tried it, I don't like it, it's very uncomfortable for me, I don't want to do it,

stop saying it, you know? And immediately the response was, what? No, like everyone went after me, my five followers. But I think the problem, what I'm trying to get at is with the self -talk and with the people who might not be diagnosed yet or might be diagnosed and they're looking to get some help. These productivity things are like the typical stuff that you hear that everyone's teaching might have to be rejected.

What do you think? It's one, don't have ADHD. Like Cal Newport. I read Deep Work and I'm like... Yes. Put yourself in a quiet room and don't look at the world. like niche down to one thing. And it's just like and I'll tell people I'm like a great way to like really just like Kick your career up is to be the queen of one little tiny niche. I cannot do it. It would be an absolute like I became a journalist because I'm curious and I love to learn about lots of little things and also I know a lot of people who are the queens of Niche XYZ and we go to coffee and they're like if I have to write about this crap one more time I'm gonna go nuts. So I'm like No, I don't to You don't have to. We don't have to do what they say.

We just have to find our system, which is something that you found. So I want to put in the links in the show notes for sure because I think you are a great stepping stone for people to come to see if they don't know you already and to find somebody who's has a great career and also has ADHD and is willing to talk about it and has created some tools. So where can people find you? What is the best way to find this tool? And then let's end with talking a little bit more about the class because if people are, you said, you know, they might need to get help. So like this is one, one offering, right, of help in which they can be really introduced to it, find people who are like them. So first, where can people find you? So

people can find me at ThatWriterPaulette .com and there are links there to Harnessing ADHD's Wild Horse Power and the Writers Mission Control Center as well. Okay, so the Writers Mission Control Center is the software that you created. So before they get into the class, do they have to do a No, you don't have to have it. I'm not going to ask for any documentation. I want documentation. Upload it, please, all of it, bank account included. So no documentation, but really it is for people who are there to learn how to really harness their career and move forward as a creative, right? Yes. Yeah. All right. So we are going to have the links in the show notes as well. I think it is a great place to really get started.

And before we go, is there any last thing that you want to tell anybody who's listening today and is like, I think I might understand what Paulette's talking about? Oh my gosh. Yeah. Just that there is this really, there's a line from Ned Hallowell, who is the first person who gave me my possible diagnosis and his his line is unwrap the gift. And he's so positive about it. And there's just if you think you have ADHD, and you're about to like, get tested and figure it out. I mean, it's going to change your life so much. Okay, and it's going to be incredible. The transformation you'll see. That's amazing. Thank you for coming on in being so open. about ADHD and about your writing journey.